Arctic Offroad Forums

Full Version: knik multi use rec area mat-su meeting
You're currently viewing a stripped down version of our content. View the full version with proper formatting.
Last night we had a emergency meeting at Matsu -central safety building ..

The friends of the matsu had tried to push a new requirement of a unknown safety buffer zone around the butte residents and streams making it a nightmare just to use the area ..

but the bill they tried to push thru was very vague with no limits or specific information ..wich worked in our favor .

alot of the comments from the folks who live on the butte dont want or need such a buffer zone .. just a very small select few who dont like the noise of the atv's and race track ..wich had came out at the board meeting ..

wich moose our old 2 broke to play president ..had said you moved innext door to a race track knowing it was a race track ..lol could have heard the snarls ...lol

but i also stood up and spoke on behalf of the offroad community ..after seeing some of the Friends of The Mat-su pass off picture of the burnt hauls of cars and the illegal shooting ..

and told them "thats one side of the story now let me tell you the other half .." and had told them about our yearly cleanups and how we off roaders and other OHV clubs ,tow the hauls up to the parking are for pick up and how our kids help pick up the trash in the area every spring and how this was a community event and how the junk yards and even the borough donates trash bags for the effort ..

one lady on the assembly asked you have to do this every year ? to wich i later replied yes just like you do evrey spring along the highway ..

one had asked about the crossing of the salmon spawning areas ?
i had told them .."thats already illegal mam ..if they do it.. punish them .

we dont need more red tape we need inforcement of the laws already on the books ".. assembly woman asked .." then it was how are we going to pay for it ? " to wich i replied " our taxes last i looked it hasnt dropped any in the last 7 years " they didnt say a word ..
it was brought up earlier about stickers on all atvs to help pay for the enforcement .. but it was also brought to their attention by alot of us is there is no legal ear marking in Alaska .. so there is no promise by the state that if we as a offroad community pay 1 million dollars for these stickers that the 1 mil will go for enforcement .. and that if this was a multi use area we want to see a sticker on the back of every horse as well .. not just punish the motorized community ..

but the good news in this is we won this small fight like 7-2 but next time they will be alot more orginized and be tougher to beat .. problem was and was brought up is on the mat-su assembly is 2 active friends of the mat-su greenies and keep trying to push this thru .. they started this this week and was going to vote on it last night before the public could even get to read and fight it ...

i will link the bill from the 4x4 network ...
this is what they were trying to push thru in a hurry without people suport who even lived on the butte ..

Here are some of BARCO's comments.


April 26, 2008

Brandon McCutcheon
Alaska Department of Natural Resources
550 West 7th Avenue, Suite 1050
Anchorage AK 99501-3579

COMMENTS ON KNIK RIVER PUBLIC USE AREA DRAFT MANAGEMENT PLAN

After reviewing the KRPUA Draft Management Plan (the Plan) it is apparent that DNR’s management guidelines are NOT compatible with the residential community that lies adjacent to the boundaries of the KRPUA. The Community of Butte existed long before the heavily increased usage of this area and the still more recent legislative creation of the KRPUA. We submit the following comments from the Butte Area Residents Civic Organization.

1) LAW ENFORCEMENT: Immediate strong and on-the-ground law enforcement is needed to ensure safety of residents and users. DNR is allowed to contract law enforcement with State of Alaska Park Rangers, since enforcing the law does not involve “managing the area as a park,” which is prohibited in HB 307.
2) SHOOTING AREAS: Upon creation of the KRPUA, we requested a ban on target shooting , pending the Commissioner’s determination of an area where shooting is not a threat to public safety. We maintain that there is no safe place to target shoot in KRPUA. In addition, existing environmental contamination of this valuable watershed from lead shot – in streams, lakes, wetlands, on the glacier and in the forests from where it migrates into the waters – is of utmost and urgent concern.
DNR-proposed Shooting Area locations:
Any future target shooting venue should be developed away from residential areas and not as a part of a Public Use Area surrounded by a growing residential population. We oppose the following proposed locations for shooting areas, because they DO constitute a threat to public safety and are incompatible with residential and recreational activities and wetlands management. These locations are not respectful to residents, school children, businesses and non-motorized users of the trails and lakes. Most of us lived here long before the heavy use of this area became such a concern, and definitely before the more recent creation of the KRPUA. Shooting areas at these locations will continue to threaten our peace and safety.
• Caudill/Sullivan Location
This is incompatible with close-by residential areas and current and future subdivision development, and is less than 1 mile distance from Butte School. The sound of gunfire in Butte carries from 1-2 miles depending on wind direction. It is also incompatible with proximity to Gull Lake and wetlands. Suggesting such a location was an affront by Mat-Su Borough Planning Consultants during the Butte Asset Management Plan Process for the original Jim Creek Parcel 1-B (East).
• Maud Road Extension near Jim Lake Location
This area is incompatible with residents from the Maud/Smith Road area who use this area for multi-use recreation, including jogging, ATV, horseback, biking, hiking and boating. It is also incompatible because of its close proximity to Jim Lake waterfowl, Jim Lake and Mud Lake canoeing and DNR-planned Jim Creek camp site.

3) SANITARY FACILITIES: DNR should immediately place and maintain temporary sanitary facilities and dumpsters at all major access points. This should include the Man-Made Lake Area.
4) OPPORTUNITIES FOR HIGH VALUE RECREATION: Lakes, wetlands, alpine transition zones and mountains, in addition to being enjoyed by residents, offer unique destinations for high-value recreational visitors from Anchorage and other areas of the state, Outside and Overseas, and offer economic opportunities and associated spinoffs for residents who plan to provide guided hiking, boating, bird watching, horseback riding, fishing and hunting and nature trips. We know of Alaskan birders from as far away as Kotzebue and Tok who have come here to observe migrating birds and search for certain species. Priority actions for these areas should include:
A) Restore wetlands and revegetate dunes.
B) Keep Rippy Trail non-motorized from its trailhead at Jim Lake to Friday Creek
C) Butte has traditionally been a “horse community.” An estimated 1,000 horses, owned by local residents on Lazy Mountain, South Knik River, Goat Creek and Butte, contribute at least. $2.5 million a year of income to local and statewide farmers, to feed, fuel supply and automobile/trailer dealers, veterinarians, farriers, trainers, and owners of equine facilities (arenas) . Many horse owners in Anchorage have expressed their desire to board, train and ride their horses in Butte if the area were made safe for parking and riding and if they could ride on non-motorized trails. For this reason we ask DNR to retain the Pavilion Parking Lot and trails on the MSB Jim Creek Parcel in MSB ownership so it can be managed for the equine and non-motorized community by whom these facilities were built before they were destroyed by motorized vandals. The opportunity to board and train horses by Butte residents creates jobs and lead to increased construction activities.
Our location, scenery, history, wildlife, fishing, hunting and trails, the vegetable farms and the reindeer farm- were it anywhere else in the world but Butte -begs for hotels, lodges, bed-and-breakfasts restaurants, or a visitor center. The beginnings of such an economy are represented by a unique lodge, built in 2007, at the end of Knik River Road offering first class service and catering primarily to visitors from overseas. They contract with local airboat and trail horse guides and employ residents as they did during construction. This venture’s success is guaranteed by virtue of its distance from motorized recreation. At this time, there is no other location on private land on the Butte side of Knik River that offers a motor-free zone. We ask DNR to please change that.

5) ACCESS and BUFFERS
We disagree with the DNR statement that, “Adjacent Non-State Lands: The adjacent non-state lands include private, borough, federal and native lands. All of the adjacent land uses have been considered and deemed compatible and all adjacent land owners have been invited to participate in the planning process.” (F-3)
Many recreational uses are not compatible with residential and private development in the Butte/ Knik River area. Residents of Butte are already burdened by nuisance noise and high traffic generated by Alaska Raceway Park. They should not have to bear the additional burden of ORV and powerboat noise near their homes.
Private property values in this area need to be protected, not trashed by a motor park and shooting area/range. The solution is to buffer residential areas from nuisance noise, dust, wild parties, gang training, and fire danger with non-motorized use lands of the KRPUA.
Other mitigation solutions should include
Create Central Access for Motorized Activities:
To mitigate the adverse impact of motorized recreation activity due to its incompatibility with residential and other private development, we support the creation of one central access point for motorized recreation to the KRPUA, to be located at the RS2477 Knik Glacier Trail head on State of Alaska land. This trailhead /parking lot would be located on the 152-acre site (MSB Jim Creek original 1-B parcel) which the Mat-Su Borough gave to DNR.
Concentrating motorized access at one central location will prevent continued unauthorized use of private lands above the mean/high water line along both sides of Knik River, and will protect Bodenburg Creek and its salmon and waterfowl habitat from further ORV damage and harassment. Dedicating the easternmost KRPUA river-bed area on both sides of the Knik River Bridge to non-motorized activities will protect residents from noise and dust and irresponsible recreational behavior and will also allow the restoration and intended multi-use activities of the Borough’s “Pavilion Parking Lot” and trails on the Jim Creek Parcel for residents from Butte, South Knik River, Goat Creek, Lazy Mountain and nearby Palmer, many of whom fondly remember the quality recreation, fishing and hunting – motorized and non-motorized - that used to be available to them.
Create Non-Motorized Access at Knik River Bridge downstream. Motorized use as it currently exists is incompatible with residential and other private development.

On the Butte side of the Knik River, DNR only owns shore lands, lands below the high water mark, that adjoin private parcels between Republican Road and Knik River to the west, including the new “high-end” Riverview Subdivision which has covenants prohibiting motorized access to and from the river. Upstream, to the east, DNR again owns only the shore lands where they adjoin the uplands of a 9-acre private parcel, 80-acre Mental Health Trust lands and the Borough’s Jim Creek parcel. To the east of the Borough’s Jim Creek parcel, DNR owns both the shore lands and the uplands. (See accompanying map).
Fourwheelers, dirt bikes and 4x4s have trespassed on adjoining private lands to get to Jim Creek and beyond. ORVs also use this access to trespass everywhere. They trespass on the powerline easement and travel on unpaved neighborhood streets and the non-motorized pathway to visit a nearby bar or gas station. These activities add to health issues of residents from dust and noise, endanger the non-motorized public (the non-motorized path has become hazardous to bicycles, horses and pedestrians not only because of rutting, but because of near-collisions with ATVs and dirt bikes), disenfranchise residents from enjoying their homes and land and discouraging visitors and residents from enjoying quiet camping or a picnic at the Knik River, taking their dogs for a walk, or just going there on a nice evening to see the sun go down in the west or “to watch the river go by. During summer weekends, most local people no longer use this area due to safety concerns and a total lack of the ‘quiet enjoyment’ it once offered.
The practical solution dealing with limited DNR ownership at the Knik River/Bodenburg Access and to prevent motorized activities which have proven to be incompatible with adjoining residential and other private development is to adhere to the intent of the legislation HB 307 and “enhance and maintain” non-motorized uses. We support dedicating to non-motorized use the Knik River shore lands from the western boundary downstream of the Knik River bridge to a point along the Borough’s Jim Creek parcel where non-motorized users can enter the trail system on this parcel.
6) LAND ACQUISITIONS BY DNR
We think the planned acquisition of private, borough and Mental Health Trust lands on the north Knik River near the Knik River bridge is a terrible idea that will further threaten the safety, peace and livability of the local residents and spread the severe damage already existing to the lands in that area. Such acquisitions would push the KRPUA usage even closer to the local residential areas. A single motorized access point would help to limit damage to Bodenburg Creek and its valuable salmon, song bird and waterfowl habitat. Making the sand flats immediately adjacent to the bridge non-motorized would greatly decrease the trespass on adjacent lands while not denying access to the upper river by the designated access point. It would also greatly minimize the dust and noise pollution and the irresponsible behavior of some recreationalists that has been an increasingly detrimental factor to local Butte/Knik River residents and a danger to motorists on the Old Glenn Highway. Already, the land values in the area have dropped as a direct consequence of the activities on the river; we must protect the land values, the safety and quality of life of the local residents, and the taxable land parcels within the borough, as well as the potential for future economic development on the private lands.

LANDS INTENDED FOR DNR ACQUISITION FOR ADDITIONAL ACCESS: We oppose acquisition of (1) any private property to increase accessibility to the south Knik River. Years ago the area that includes subdivisions around 8 ½ mile Knik River Road was designated part of a National Natural Landmark Area. Until now, this area has been a quiet area where most access to the river has been non-motorized or limited 4 wheeler usage (until the last few years when one resident has allowed access to neighbors with large trucks). Except in times of very low water or when the river is frozen, there has not been public access to this area, and it has maintained its quiet, serene setting. This is the reason that many residents live here! For instance, one resident has chronic, disabling health problem and chose this area for its easy walking access (her driving is limited) and quiet, serene lifestyle. Some residents access the river at least 5 times a week to hike or run a trap line. Many did not want the original boundaries of the KRPUA to include this side of the river up this far, and most do not want increased access to this area in any way whatsoever. Such access (i.e. a proposed future 17B access through Eklutna land from the end of the platted Justin Road) would be severely detrimental to not only the residents of this subdivision, but to residents of the Knik River Road who would have to put up with the increased traffic including illegal 4 wheeler use of the road and trucks with trailers traveling to this access point. Such an easement would result in a new ‘party area’ where ATV travel on the small sand beaches would greatly impinge on local peace (noise levels), safety, and air quality from the dust. This area is generally upriver of ‘dust clouds’ created by both winds and motorized use of the other side of the river, but the frequent high winds would distribute the dust raised by nearby motorized vehicles to all of this neighborhood and beyond. This area is out of the ‘high use area’ as designated in the original regulations for shooting etc, and yet would become a high use area. Why does DNR want another area to have to police, and run not the risk but the certainty of severe habitat damage such as has occurred on the north side of the river to become mirrored on the south side? How would DNR prevent trespass on the adjacent private properties including the Eklutna lands? How would DNR protect resident’s property values, safety, and peaceable existence when no one has been able to do that for the residents adjacent to the current high use areas?

A good part of the summer, no access upriver from this area is possible because of high water in Hunter Creek; however, a few very large wheeled trucks have done it, and have risked the lives of themselves and their rescuers trying! Hunter Creek and its sloughs are heavily used salmon spawning areas, most years the number of spawning salmon here rivals that in Bodenburg Creek. Late fall before freeze up finds hundreds to thousands of dead salmon floating in the river and its sloughs; bald eagle populations and brown bear populations rise considerably during this period. In order to get upriver from the area that would be accessed from the proposed 17B easement, Hunter Creek and its slough would be crossed; and unfortunately many motorized vehicle users do not simply cross the water but drive up any body of water they can, regardless of water quality or spawning fish. Because of water levels, crossing the creek and sloughs is possible mostly in fall, when the salmon are spawning, and in spring, when the fingerlings are attempting to survive the low water. The motorized intrusions into this anadromous stream are contrary to existing laws protecting the state salmon populations.

In addition, this area is a heavily used moose calving area in the spring. Residents annually watch the birth of new moose calves on their or adjacent properties. By the time the calves are up and moving this little area becomes a veritable nursery of cows and calves. Residents restrict dog activity and put a stop to any loose, wandering dogs, and the moose and calves thrive. Increased usage of the area would put this valuable moose calving in jeopardy. Here in the Mat Su Borough, the decreased numbers of moose and salmon have both been in the news of late; why do we want to further threaten these species by further encroaching on their valuable habitat?

We also oppose acquisition of :
(2) the private property, known as the old Russ & Rusty Dow 9-acre parcel, at Knik River/Bodenburg Creek Access. The parcel and Bodenburg Creek are already severely damaged this property needs to remain in private hands as a buffer from public use:
(3) the 80-acre Mental Health Trust Lands parcel, popular location of partiers and bonfires, now with severely rutted trails and many cuts into the banks, that used to be the natural protection from all but the highest Knik River floodwaters. This parcel connects the Mat-Su Borough’s Racetrack Buffer and Jim Creek parcel. This parcel, located along the north side of Knik River, should be managed as forested wildlife shelter and buffer for moose. While this parcel also acts as wind and erosion control buffer for the community, connecting the Borough’s Raceway Buffer and Jim Creek parcels, it is the only public land available before entering private property when moose migrate down the Knik River Valley from the mountains to the Knik-Matanuska Delta and Hay Flats. These lands also provide quiet forested shelter for wildlife:
(4) Large portion of the Mat-Su Borough Jim Creek Parcel including the Pavilion, Envy and Sexton Trails. Note that the Mat-Su Borough has already given approx. 252 acres east of the Jim Creek Parcel to DNR after the Butte Asset Management Plan process. We have repeatedly proposed that the Borough manage this parcel for the benefit of its tax-paying residents for the purpose of a community park with playgrounds for all ages. Recent history on these lands bears witness that increased motorized recreation brings more damage that inevitably will continue on those lands the Borough would retain. The Pavilion Parking Lot and several trails were constructed and/or improved by the equine community. We encourage that MSB make a portion of the Pavilion Parking Lot for non-motorized use only that includes parking for horse trailers and also add a small camp ground/picnic area at this location. In the 1980s the equine community, in cooperation with the Mat-Su Borough, developed a trail system starting at Lazy Mountain to connect with Sexton and Envy trails to the Knik River. We also encourage the MSB to manage this parcel for multiple use access, albeit with speed/traffic control on shared roads or trails, for use by residents to get to Jim Creek and possibly creating a camp ground/parking lot in the upland forests before dropping down to Jim Creek. This is our opportunity to start over with good management of trails and facilities. This Borough Jim Creek parcel is a valuable asset to the community; too valuable to be used as motocross and pass-through to the KRPUA, but will provide more economic opportunities for residents of Butte if managed properly.

7) MANMADE LAKE: Residents continue to support “no motorized use” on Manmade Lake. Manmade Lake was established by petition of Butte resident Kay Frank, as a non-motorized "swimming hole" when Knik River Road was built. Motorized activity at or near Manmade Lake is not compatible with adjoining residential development. Recent use by snowmachines over the open waters, of necessity at high speeds to keep afloat, are also polluting to the lake waters themselves and dangerous to swimmers and campers.
A boat launch on the Knik River is not compatible with residential development on both sides of Knik River. 24/7 noise and engine fumes are a risk to residents’ health and well-being and deprive them of the full enjoyment of their homes and properties.
8) TIMESHARE OPTIONS: We support time-share options for motorized traffic on land and all waters including the Knik River.
Noise and exhaust from airboats, powerboats and personal watercraft are not compatible with the residential developments along or near the Knik River. The noise reverberates off the mountains and robs residents of sleep and tranquility. Airboats going upriver can be heard from houses along Knik River Road with their windows closed, and motorized traffic on the north side of the river can be heard by residents in Butte and South Knik River throughout the night. Recognizing that boats of all sizes are a legitimate use within the KRPUA, we recommend mitigation of the incompatibilities with a time-share agreement. Excluded from the time-share will be current commercial airboat services and current ATV tour operators. Motorized traffic for licensed hunters will be allowed during season; hours may be restricted to protect residents near Knik River from noise and dust. This will benefit different users to recreate without conflict, give respite to wildlife, and allow residents to enjoy their homes and yards without nuisance noise from power boats, personal watercraft and ORVs.
9) CLEAN WATER, HEALTHY FISH & WILDLIFE HABITAT: We support effective protection measures to ensure that our community will have plentiful and clean water supply now and in the future. DNR has to stop the pollution of stream, lakes and rivers from automotive contaminants, lead, human waste and hazardous substances of the kind found during cleanups of the area. DNR has to protect our wetlands and stop the ongoing erosion of dunes, forests and stream banks. Any future permits for resource extraction, i.e. gravel, in this area, if granted, should be carefully constrained so as to not infringe on the existing water rights and future water needs of the residential community.
It is incumbent upon DNR to apply and enforce all state, federal and local laws that currently apply to the management of waters, habitat, fish, wildlife, waterfowl and migratory birds and/or cause these laws to be enforced through cooperative agreements with these agencies. No laws shall be rescinded in order to allow damage to the ground cover or stream banks that are caused by recreational activity in the KRPUA. It is contrary to HB 307 – purpose (2) , contrary to the intent of the legislators in their debates, and is incompatible with those motorized users who use the trails to travel rather than to conquer mud, water and bogs. Handicapped ATV users have testified to the importance of having motorized access in the KRPUA for their enjoyment. Instead, the current condition of deeply rutted and eroded trails, especially in the forests, caters to motocross, not to handicapped use.
IN CONCLUSION, it would be our hope that the formation and management of the Knik River Public Use Area would result in better recreational opportunities for the largest variety of users, while minimizing the nuisance, damage and dangers to private property owners/residents of the Butte/Knik River Area. The Shorelines Management Act states that if activities from federal or state access spills over to private lands, that result needs to be addressed. The mitigation of detrimental effects to the local community from the increased and generally uncontrolled recreational usage of this area should be of PRIMARY concern to the regulators. Our private property rights and our community/local values need to be protected. As nearby residents and users of this area, we urge DNR to protect and enhance the lands, wildlife habitat, and waters of the KRPUA, and to not create an untenable situation by increasing access and use near private lands on the South Knik River.
Respectfully Submitted,
s/ Gregory Nilsson & Brit Lively for Butte Area Residents Civic Organization
Good work Wayne.
How did you hear about the short notice meeting?
we have 2 good watch dogs looking all the time with trail closures and restrictions on the 4x4 network and seem to be almost always 2 steps ahead .. i was dissapointed on the turnout of other valley users of the area though ...

we had 3 wheelers there rest was residents of the sullivan rd ..the area in question