Zuki Axle Swap

[LowNSlowNeon]

I am thinking about buying parts slowly to do an axle swap on the zuk. I saw the widetrack d44 axles on ak4x4network for $200! Which is pretty cheap IMO.... but they might be TOO wide?... They will work with my zuk with some modifcations of the springs, steering, Brake lines (US to metric), Parking brake and drive shafts...




The guy on the ZU forum said they'd work nicely.. but would be a tad WIDER than this pic...

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/whitfimb/1270610.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/whitfimb/1270608.jpg

Is that ridiculously too wide?... It's slowly gonna be turned into a trail rig only... so I don't mind it not being street legal.

I could get more backspacing on the wheels and tuck em in a little bit more... but what's your opinons?..

Regear em and lock em and rock em ? ;)

[LowNSlowNeon]

http://www.zukikrawlers.com/albums/TX_ZUKI/bmra103004_018.jpg


http://www.zukikrawlers.com/albums/TX_ZUKI/2004_1030Barnwell0085.jpg

http://www.zukikrawlers.com/albums/TX_ZUKI/DSC00634_1.jpg

These are what they'd look like width wise..

[TJVigilante]

That's alot of width there...talk about trail-only.

[naturalbornmudder]

I like it but they'll be no way it will be street legal.

[LowNSlowNeon]

I like it but they'll be no way it will be street legal.



Yea like I said though... I don't care bout street legal. I could drive it to work like that if I wanted.. (only place the zuk ever goes but I dont HAVE to take it to work).... and to the trails.. until I get a trailer :0


Unless I find some local axles or some somewhere else. I won't be buying them from this guy.. he's a +++++.

http://www.alaska4x4network.com/showthread.php?t=13990

[Advent]

Dan's not a +++++...He wouldn't be the president of Alaska Extreme if he were...

You need FJ40 or FJ60 axles. They'll keep the offset rear, they're as strong (or stronger with the 300m birfields) as Dana 44s, and you can get them cheap. I've got a set of FJ60 axles stashed at Kevin's that I paid $250 for, and I bought an FJ40 front this summer (since gutted) for $175 including shipping from Kodiak.

Plus you get removable 3rd members when you want to do gear or locker swaps. I've got a spare 3rd with the correct gearing so that if I decide I don't like the front locker on ice I can swap it out in about half an hour.

FJ40 axles are 55" wide, FJ60 axles are 58" wide, and widetrack fullsize jeep axles are 61" wide.

And if Nate's listening...It's possible to flip the housing over on a 'cruiser front axle and run it driver's drop. With the IFS hub conversion an FJ60 axle would be the same width as a TJ front. I've heard of people swapping them into Cherokees. With a centered 'cruiser rear housing, it would make a great swap into a TJ.

But nobody ever listens to me when I tell them how much of a bargin 'cruiser/toyota parts are, so you might as well have skipped this post ::)

[LowNSlowNeon]

Dan's not a +++++...He wouldn't be the president of Alaska Extreme if he were...

You need FJ40 or FJ60 axles. They'll keep the offset rear, they're as strong (or stronger with the 300m birfields) as Dana 44s, and you can get them cheap. I've got a set of FJ60 axles stashed at Kevin's that I paid $250 for, and I bought an FJ40 front this summer (since gutted) for $175 including shipping from Kodiak.

Plus you get removable 3rd members when you want to do gear or locker swaps. I've got a spare 3rd with the correct gearing so that if I decide I don't like the front locker on ice I can swap it out in about half an hour.

FJ40 axles are 55" wide, FJ60 axles are 58" wide, and widetrack fullsize jeep axles are 61" wide.

And if Nate's listening...It's possible to flip the housing over on a 'cruiser front axle and run it driver's drop. With the IFS hub conversion an FJ60 axle would be the same width as a TJ front. I've heard of people swapping them into Cherokees. With a centered 'cruiser rear housing, it would make a great swap into a TJ.

But nobody ever listens to me when I tell them how much of a bargin 'cruiser/toyota parts are, so you might as well have skipped this post ::)



Just because he is the president of anything doesn't mean he is not a +++++. He's a +++++ to me....

Don't hate me because I don't have a digital camera. Take your self righteous attitude, stick it in your butt and spin on it.

I was not rude at all.. but let's keep this ON topic...


I'll look into FJ axles as well.. Thanks

[naturalbornmudder]

And if Nate's listening...It's possible to flip the housing over on a 'cruiser front axle and run it driver's drop. With the IFS hub conversion an FJ60 axle would be the same width as a TJ front. I've heard of people swapping them into Cherokees. With a centered 'cruiser rear housing, it would make a great swap into a TJ.

But nobody ever listens to me when I tell them how much of a bargin 'cruiser/toyota parts are, so you might as well have skipped this post

I am just waiting for you to prove your theory by getting GIR running so I can see anything cruiser-wise in action

[Advent]

You might give Mark Whatley a call. He runs a shop called Cruisers Only in Wasilla, and he's got a pile about 6' high of 'cruiser axles, in addition to the ones under his parts rigs. He usually cuts a pretty good deal on them, but it would be higher than you'd pay private party (obviously). 907-373-3789

I looked it up and Samurai axles are 52.2" wide. So even FJ40 axles would be a little wider. They're probably the best width for you.

If you get an FJ40 front, there are some notable differences. A '75 and earlier will have drum brakes and birfields not much stronger than yours. That axle is good for the housing, shafts, and 3rd. But you'd need a mini truck or FJ60 axle to steal the knuckles, hubs, and birfs off of. A '76-'78 FJ40 axle has the same steering arm bolt pattern as the earlier knuckles, but with larger birfields and disc brakes. It's a fine axle, but the steering arm bolt pattern isn't large enough to handle 38" plus tires. The '79-'83 FJ40 axles have the same birfields, hubs, and steering arm pattern as the mini trucks and FJ60s, but are a bit harder to find.

If you REALLY wanted to go overkill, the best route to go is get a '68-'75 FJ40 front axle, Marlin Crawler's new upgraded knuckles, and the 300m Birfields. I've got a spare set of hubs that would fit that I'd let go of for pretty cheap, or you could even buy them new ($$$). With the 300m Birfields, the front axle shafts test to as strong as a stock Dana 60.

Actually...If you were to find a '68-'75 front axle, I've got a spare set of '76-'78 knuckles, brakes and hubs. I don't need them but I didn't want to throw them away when I replaced my front axle this summer. I doubt the smaller bolt pattern on the steering arms would ever become a problem on a Samurai, and it's still pretty easy to get quality high steer arms for them. I don't want to get rid of my spare birfields though, so you'd need to find a set (that's not hard, last ones I bought were $30 each). Figure $50 for the hubs and knuckles would be pretty fair, and I bet you could get a drum brake axle for under $100.

Nate - GIR runs...It just doesn't charge.

[AK20]

For $600 a set for 30 spline 300m Birfs I would hope they are as strong as a STOCK Dana 60!!!!

[Advent]

How much do CTMs and chromoly shafts for a Dana 44 cost?

Looking it up...

From Polyperformance.com:
$139.99 for the outer shafts
$185 for the short side inner shaft
$210 for the long side inner shaft
$198.99 for EACH CTM 300m u-joint

$932.97 total for the same basic package you get for $600 for the 'cruiser axles.

Edit: LNS, another thought would be a mini truck front axle with an FJ40 rear. The mini front axle is the same width as an FJ40 front, but has an 8" ring gear instead of the 'cruiser 8.875". The reason I usually reccomend 'cruiser fronts is because usually you can get them much cheaper than a mini truck front due to lack of demand.

[gamble71]

yeah, I don't buy on line without a pic or getting to see it firsthand either. Bit of a drive just to see some axles though :D

[AK20]

How much do CTMs and chromoly shafts for a Dana 44 cost?


I don't deny there both expensive, I'm just saying it's a lot money to build an axle thats only as strong as a stock 60. I realize 60's are not feasible for every build, and in no way am I knocking the Toy axles they actually sound like a better alternative to 44's. FYI, for $350 I could get 35 spline cromo outers with Dana Life Serier joints and Premium Lock-outs or Flanges and be alot stronger than either of those two axles for almost half the price. That is if you don't count the initial buying price of most Dana 60's!!!

[LowNSlowNeon]

I heard from a mouse (no not mouseE) that holeski might have a bunch of a 44s laying around .... ???

[TJVigilante]

Why are we arguing what's as strong as a D60 when we're talking about a samurai here? D44's are fine, if he can get a good deal, good. he's not going to snap shafts in a D44, if he does he can worry about that later. Jeez people.

And yeah, I thought Holeski had a bunch of fsj axles sitting around(probably in pieces)

[LowNSlowNeon]

Why are we arguing what's as strong as a D60 when we're talking about a samurai here? D44's are fine, if he can get a good deal, good. he's not going to snap shafts in a D44, if he does he can worry about that later. Jeez people.

And yeah, I thought Holeski had a bunch of fsj axles sitting around(probably in pieces)


LOL exactly why I didn't jump into it...


If I am breaking D44s with 33s... 60HP and a "Crawling around" type of wheeler.....

Something is wrong...

[AK20]

Well he posting pics of zuki's he wants his to look like, and I'd bet money any one of those posted above could snap a 44 shaft.

Point being is to do it right the first time, your money ahead in the long run. You don't know were the zuki could be in a year or two, maybe then you'll a 4.3 vortec and 38's...do you want to waste money an axles twice or buy a good set now and not worry about it later?

[LowNSlowNeon]

Well he posting pics of zuki's he wants his to look like, and I'd bet money any one of those posted above could snap a 44 shaft.

Point being is to do it right the first time, your money ahead in the long run. You don't know were the zuki could be in a year or two, maybe then you'll a 4.3 vortec and 38's...do you want to waste money an axles twice or buy a good set now and not worry about it later?



Big reason I like the waggy axle idea is that they are common axles and are proven to work good in the zukis ;)

[4x4_MMMH_4x4]

ill sell you a complete FSJ lns, 350$ has axles wheels, tires, engine, tranny and tcase... runs drives and moves... not happily though...

[sevenslats]

I know you've moved on. but that's the same Dan I bought my front d44 from. Dan is a hell of a guy. You must have caught him at a bad time. He's extremely busy, so that's why he has short conversations.

[LowNSlowNeon]

I know you've moved on. but that's the same Dan I bought my front d44 from.+ Dan is a hell of a guy.+ You must have caught him at a bad time.+ He's extremely busy, so that's why he has short conversations.


I dont want the widetracks anyhow.. a lil TOO wide..

I am trying to track down them axles rob was selling.... I think Nate got em and then passed em on to Kevin.. .not sure if he plans on using em.. Mousee told me I should pass on them.. .but I really want some d44s :D

I'll try to find some axles.. .grab em up..... then save up for the rest ...

[STOMPR]

Wouldnt the Chevy axles be just as wide or wider?

[LowNSlowNeon]

Wouldnt the Chevy axles be just as wide or wider?


I was under the impression they were a TAD bit shorter.. Oh well..

I still won't purchase from Dan :D

[STOMPR]

Thats cool if you you dont wanna buy from him just dont go postal
http://www.freesmileys.org/emo/violent068.gif

[Advent]

Wouldnt the Chevy axles be just as wide or wider?

I was under the impression they were a TAD bit shorter.. Oh well..

Try 8" wider up front, 6" wider in the rear. For a total of 69.5" up front and 67" in the rear. Those axles alone would be wider than your entire rig right now.

Why do you want Dana 44s so bad? Toyota/FJ40 axles are as strong or stronger, cheaper and easier to fit.

[LowNSlowNeon]

Wouldnt the Chevy axles be just as wide or wider?

I was under the impression they were a TAD bit shorter.. Oh well..

Try 8" wider up front, 6" wider in the rear. For a total of 69.5" up front and 67" in the rear. Those axles alone would be wider than your entire rig right now.

Why do you want Dana 44s so bad? Toyota/FJ40 axles are as strong or stronger, cheaper and easier to fit.


8" wider than the widetrack d44s or wider than my stock? ... I dont mind em being wide :D

[Advent]

Samurai: 52.2"
FJ40/Mini truck: 55"
FJ60: 58"
Narrow track Dana 44s: 58"
Widtrack Dana 44s: 61"
Chevy fullsize 44s: 69"

[LowNSlowNeon]

Samurai: 52.2"
FJ40/Mini truck: 55"
FJ60: 58"
Narrow track Dana 44s: 58"
Widtrack Dana 44s: 61"
Chevy fullsize 44s: 69"



o rly? :(

[Advent]

It should also be noted that most Widetrack Dana 44s are driver's drop.

Edit: If you want to think about Dodge Dana 44s, they're 2" narrower than the Chevys, at 67" wide. Still way too big to take down any tight trails though.

You really don't want to go that much wider on a sammi. The biggest advantage they have is the ability to fit down a 4 wheeler trail. Don't eliminate that, you might as well get a fullsize with a beater body.

[LowNSlowNeon]

It should also be noted that most Widetrack Dana 44s are driver's drop.

Edit: If you want to think about Dodge Dana 44s, they're 2" narrower than the Chevys, at 67" wide. Still way too big to take down any tight trails though.

You really don't want to go that much wider on a sammi. The biggest advantage they have is the ability to fit down a 4 wheeler trail. Don't eliminate that, you might as well get a fullsize with a beater body.


You're right....I just liked the D44s because everyone has em and easy to get ya know?...

FJ40/Mini truck: 55"
FJ60: 58"

Those are wider but not INSANELY wider.. sounds like the prime choice of axles...

[STOMPR]

Why do you even want to swap axles didnt you just regear and spool those?

[LowNSlowNeon]

Stock gears.. spooled rear end..

Just preparing it for the worst. :D

I want to lock the front.. but I dont want to build my stock front axle up just to eventually swap them out....

[Advent]

You're right....I just liked the D44s because everyone has em and easy to get ya know?...

FJ40/Mini truck: 55"
FJ60: 58"

Those are wider but not INSANELY wider.. sounds like the prime choice of axles...

I find that Toyota axles are generally easier to find than 55 or 58" wide passenger drop Dana 44s. Parts are a complete non-issue. The only part you can't get new is the housing (though there are aftermarket housings available). The last passenger drop wagoneer 44 was built in 1979, the last FJ62 (same as the FJ62 except for a little extra gusseting) was built in 1990.

If you came across a '74 or earlier FJ40 with it's axles, I might be willing to go in on the purchase of it. I'm looking for a rig for Erica, and I only need a body, frame, springs and title. Just need to figure out where I'd put it :P